Upcoming Tax Changes and How You Should Plan for Them

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The Hosts:

Kevin Kroskey, CFP®, MBA – About – Contact

Tyler Emrick, CFA®, CFP® – About – Contact

Episode Transcript:

Tyler Emrick:

The countdown to major tax changes is on as the 2017 tax cuts approach, their 2025 expiration. Today, we unpack the upcoming tax shakeup and what it means for your bottom line.

Walter Storholt:

It’s another episode of Retire Smarter. Walter Storholt here alongside Tyler Emrick, a chartered financial analyst and Certified Financial Planner® at True Wealth Design. You can find out more about the team online at truewealthdesign.com, including booking a 15-minute call with an experienced advisor to see if you’d be a good fit to work with the team. Tyler, it is great to be with you once again this week. We are marching our way through October now. The listeners don’t usually know this but we’re recording today’s episode in advance for the first time in maybe many-

Tyler Emrick:

Yes, we are.

Walter Storholt:

… Months or moons. It’s a different feeling for you today, I think.

Tyler Emrick:

It is. It’s always good to be ahead and not under the gun last minute, just the day or two before. So, yeah, a much-welcome change.

Walter Storholt:

I’m impressed. Tyler is on top of his game is what I’m getting at folks here today.

Tyler Emrick:

Well, I sort of had to be because this is going to be a short week for me as my brother is getting married, so we’re going to be-

Walter Storholt:

Oh, congratulations.

Tyler Emrick:

… having a few days off. Yes, yes, yes. He’s-

Walter Storholt:

Local?

Tyler Emrick:

… pretty pumped. Not local, so I’m surprised he’s getting married in Key West.

Walter Storholt:

Wow. A little destination wedding.

Tyler Emrick:

Okay. Destination. It is. I’ve never been. So, we’re heading out this week, Jen and I. It’s our first few days away from the kids too. As probably a lot of listeners know, we have two little toddlers, so it’s going to be a week of firsts. I’m ahead of the game on the podcast, leaving the kids for a couple of days. We’ll see how this week goes.

Walter Storholt:

That’s a couple of exciting milestones all smashed together there. That’s great.

Tyler Emrick:

It is.

Walter Storholt:

I assume you’re flying down.

Tyler Emrick:

I am flying down, although we will see. We’re all on guard. Of course, there’s a hurricane barreling towards Florida right now, so hopefully everybody’s safe and all good. It seems like Key West is going to get spared a bit but obviously, we’re tracking that pretty well.

Walter Storholt:

Unless something dramatic happens after our recording today, then… It seems like that southern part’s going to make it out from this situation. The central part of Florida just looks like they’re in for a rough ride. By the time this episode releases, we’ll know all of what happened there. But yeah, absolutely. Safe travels to you. I hope it’s a wonderful time for your brother and a fun time away for you as well. Give us some updates when we reconvene on our next episode.

Tyler Emrick:

Will do.

Walter Storholt:

Awesome.

Tyler Emrick:

Ready to jump into tax? How about-

Walter Storholt:

Hey, taxes.

Tyler Emrick:

… that transition for you?

Walter Storholt:

Let’s talk about it. Not a great segue between Key West and taxes here, I suppose but yes, I hope we all know that there are some major changes to the tax code coming down the pike. Not necessarily because of announced changes, but because we’re going to have some things expiring, the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act and the Trump tax cuts may be easier to say it as it’s become known over the years as well. They sunset soon and Tyler, that’s going to cost some issues, right?

Tyler Emrick:

It is, or potentially. As always, I always preface by our good old tax system is a little complex. It’s hard when changes and laws pass through to make those changes permanent, especially when it comes to fiscal policy. The TCJ or Tax Cut and Jobs Act or aka Trump tax cuts. Boy, pick your poison on what you want to call it. Back in 2017 past, there were the sunset provisions. At the end of 2025, we’re going to see a little bit of changes. The TCJ was pretty substantial generational tax legislation. The tax cuts cost a little over 5 trillion or so roughly. A large percentage that was paid through reforms, something to the tune of around 4 trillion. We’re throwing around some pretty big numbers. Anytime you start talking about trillions of dollars here, there’s some major impact for us as individuals, corporations, and the like.

With the code set to expire, now not everything’s going to expire, but for a lot of the listeners what impacts them directly, which we’ll jump into today here, a lot of that is going to expire. So, we’ll focus on that but we will see what happens. With the deadline looming, whatever administration pulls through the election here, they’re going to have a pretty tall task ahead of them when it comes to taxes. A lot of times, when we look at legislation, one of the reasons why we have the sunset is there’s a whole bunch of rules, and if you go back and look through all the articles back in 2017, you would’ve seen quite a bit on the Senate budget rules and trying to abide by them and really prohibiting some of this legislation to be permanent. As we think about what’s ahead, the new government is going to have to raise close to 4 trillion to keep the current tax cuts in place, not a small chunk of change [inaudible 00:05:34].

Walter Storholt:

We’re just throwing those trillions around these days.

Tyler Emrick:

At some point, I would think debts and deficits matter, and it’s going to take a pretty darn big effort. The TCJ originally, in 2017, was a once-in-generation tax reform. I think it was almost 30 years prior before we’ve seen any substantial tax reform. That’s a long time. They’ve got another big task ahead of them coming up here in 2025. I think it’s important for the listeners to take a step back and really try to wrap their arms around, well, how is this going to impact them and their day-to-day. As they’re going surely be inundated with news headlines on this come 2025, what do they need to know that’s going to impact them directly? Because simply put, if nothing happens between now and the end of 2025, we’re going to see a bit of a tax hike, or at least the vast majority of us are.

If we take a step back and maybe do a little bit of a history lesson on why was 2017 changes, why did they come about? At the time, I think a big goal of those changes was to actually reform the corporate tax rate. At the time, the U.S. corporate tax rate was one of the highest globally, and the U.S. really just could not keep up competitively. For the decade prior, I think GDP growth was around a percent and a half per year, which is on the low side. A lot of U.S. companies were moving overseas at the time, or maybe even being bought out by their international counterparts. So, the goal of that TCJ was to really make it competitive again from a business standpoint and update our tax code to make it up with the times.

Like I mentioned before, it was almost 30 years prior before we had seen anything pretty substantial. Kevin Brady, who was the chairman of the House Ways and Means Committee, who most individuals say was the architect of the TCJ know his words were, “It is important to get U.S. companies on a good footing to compete globally. But also, as it comes down to the families,” which inevitably are listening to the podcast here today, they also wanted to, in his words, “fight this idea that their paychecks were stagnant and build a tax code for growth.” Using his words.

They had those two big ideas in mind when they headed in and were working on the TCJ. The changes, I think, reflected that. And one of the biggest changes for individuals who maybe as we take a step back and say, well, what are the changes? One of the big ones was on the corporate side. They reduced the corporate tax rate from 35% to 21% and brought the U.S. in the middle of the pack. That was the only permanent change in the TCJ. Everything else we talk about today will revert come the end of 2025.

Walter Storholt:

Wow, that’s going to be a lot… Interesting when you have such a sweeping item like this and only one element of it is going to be permanent.

Tyler Emrick:

Going to be permanent. Right. As you think about that, the change, it’s going to impact us. There’s a host of things that were in the tax legislation. By no means do we have time to cover them all, but I want to pick out some of the ones that I think are going to be the most impactful for our listeners and maybe walk through them, talk about them and really explain and give some insight into what our approach has been to plan for them and what some of the individuals should be thinking of as we approach this 2025 deadline that’s going to be here before we know it. There are some changes that I think I’m not going to spend a ton of time on, but they are important. You think about things like the Child Tax Credit income limit increases. For those individuals who are getting a child tax credit and maybe are on the higher income side of things, that child tax credit might go away or be substantially reduced. There was a change in regards to AMT taxes or Alternative Minimum Taxes. Walt, have you ran into that one before, AMT?

Walter Storholt:

Yes. I feel like you mentioned that on a recent episode. Maybe it came up, I don’t know. One of our past tax episodes I think you mentioned just a little bit.

Tyler Emrick:

Sure. If any listeners have ever been subject to AMT prior to 20, this exemption and phase-out threshold changing at the end of 2025 could be a pretty big deal. That was one of the changes. We also had this 20% small business deduction, which we call QBI or Qualified Business Income deduction. That’s a big part. If there’s any small business owners listening today, I’m sure QBI has been a pretty big conversation with you and your financial advisor and CPA. We always looking to see how can we maximize that particular deduction and the like. They also created these Opportunity Zones, and so for some individuals who are looking for tax breaks and some benefits with how they deploy their capital, the Opportunity Zones was a big part of the legislation as well. Those are a handful of maybe the smaller items that we’re not going to spend a ton of time on today, but certainly, will impact some of the listeners.

And for those individuals that have heard some of these buzzwords before, Opportunity Zones, QBI deduction, those going away potentially will have some major impact to their day-to-day lives. And certainly, when they come to file their taxes come 2026 if nothing comes in. But I think the meat and potatoes of today is going to be covering some of the other changes that I think are a little bit more broadly affecting some of us here Walt. So, let’s jump into those and see what we can do to plan for them.

Walter Storholt:

Okay. What’s first on your docket?

Tyler Emrick:

Yep. First on the list is going to be the lowering of income tax brackets. The TCJ back in 2017, one of the biggest changes that they did was decrease the tax rate or ordinary income tax brackets. It was about a 3% decrease for most brackets. Not all brackets seen 3% decrease, but in aggregate, most listeners can realize and say, hey, they’re paying about 3% less in taxes on their ordinary income right now, and that will revert or sunset back. There are a large portion of us here that are going to be looking at an increase in ordinary income taxes that they’re going to have to pay. For example, the second tax rate is 12% on income right now, that’s set to go to 15. The next tax bracket is 22%, that’s set to go up to 25. There’s a whole host. These brackets will go all the way up to 37% right now.

So, each one we’re looking at either a slight or minor increase in them come 2026 if nothing changes. Of course, too, as we think about income tax planning, I think it’s important to remember that the US has a progressive income tax system. That means that essentially the more income that you have hit your tax return, your average tax burden should increase with that increased income. The way that shakes out and comes to fruition is, hey, while the top 1% of income earners are covering about a little under half of the total income tax burden, which is I think a little unusually high compared to our international counterparts. And then of course, the bottom half of income earners, which are individual that are right up to the middle class, only cover about 2% of the income tax burden. So, you’re starting to see that… I think those stats are reflective of what a progressive income tax system is meant to do. It’s meant to tax higher-income earners more and have them cover a little bit more of the burden there.

Walter Storholt:

I find it interesting twice in the episode today, and I appreciate this, your comparison to international counterparts, just seeing where we stack up internationally. Shoot, that might make a really interesting episode one day, by the way, Tyler maybe even file this one away, not just tax code, but looking at all sorts of different parts of maybe our economy or the way we do finances and retirement planning. And of course, taxes could be a big component of that, but where we differ or align internationally with various countries. That would be I think a really interesting experiment to explore and discuss a bit. But I was surprised to hear that both on the corporate rate you were mentioning earlier and in the progressive tax being a little bit higher of that burden for the wealthy, caring a little bit more than some of those international counterparts. It’d be interesting to break that down some more sometime.

Tyler Emrick:

Yeah, I think it’s important just to gain perspective.

Walter Storholt:

Perspective. Yeah, exactly.

Tyler Emrick:

Anytime we can do that in a way that helps quantify like, well, hey, what situation are we in? How is this impacting us? I think it’s helpful. And certainly, as individuals are thinking about their investment portfolios, boy, that international tax code and how we stack up really comes to fruition and is going to be trickled down into your actual investments and your 401(k) accounts and the stocks that you’re putting your money in for sure.

Walter Storholt:

That helps to be able to say, okay, oh, there’s a tax break here for the rich, and that’s boo or frustrating. And you might say, well, but yeah, but it’s been really high comparatively to other developed nations and countries and things like that. That perspective is helpful.

Tyler Emrick:

Yeah. I mentioned that Kevin Brady’s name, who was the, again, former chairman of the House Ways and Means Committee, who really led the direction on the TCJ. He’s brought up many times in articles that I had mentioned or that I’ve come across over the years. And certainly, as you think about some of the work that we did to prep for the podcast today and some of his comments. It was extremely important that the U.S. is in a spot to garner innovation and keeping these innovative companies here at home, that obviously keeps whole sorts of other things here that helps drive our economy. And boy, you want to start talking about some complex things to wrap your arms around to try to make policy around. I don’t envy them at all, Walt. Economics was some of the coursework that I had through school and certainly, continues to be some of the toughest topics as I of think about just some of the periphery of what a financial advisor has to get into. Economics is [inaudible 00:16:51].

Walter Storholt:

You mentioned trickle-down. Just trying to see that forest through the trees of high-level changes and how they’ll impact an individual way down the ecosystem is mind-boggling.

Tyler Emrick:

Oh, it is. You think about just this particular change, all right, well, hey, in simplified terms in 2026, tax rates are likely to go up for the vast majority of us. You use that general concept and of say, well, how can I apply that to my specific situation and what’s ahead of me? I think back to an individual that we met with earlier on this year. This individual had been retired for about a year. So, he is heading into his second year of retirement, and that first year they really just had lived off their cash. And the bulk of their retirement assets, as with most of us here, is actually in pre-tax retirement accounts. They had saved in 401(k)s, Walt, for most of their lives and got a nice sum of money in there, and this is going to be a good pot for them to live off of as they of are in retirement and progress through it.

But you think about that last year and them living off of their cash and you set the stage, that prior year their income tax was pretty low because they didn’t have a whole lot hitting their income. But you take a step back and do that thousand-foot view and go and say, well, hey, what’s ahead of him? Well, hey, income tax rates are set to go up, so that means his IRA distributions are going to be taxed likely at a higher rate. We might’ve missed an opportunity here to potentially say, hey, could he have pulled some money out of his retirement accounts, maybe paid taxes at a lower rate over the last year and maybe got some money inside of a Roth that grew tax-free, or at least getting it into a pot of money where they can start living off of it a little more tax efficiently going forward.

But it’s not always that simple. The way I painted that picture was like, okay, well hey, might’ve missed an opportunity there. We could have taken income a little bit higher, and paid lower in taxes. But as we get down into the weeds of each individual situation, there’s a lot of levers there that we could potentially pull. This individual was under 65, so they’re still on individual healthcare getting ready to start getting subsidies from the government on their healthcare so that income is going to impact that. Walt, we’ve talked about that many a times here on the podcast. This individual also had some unique opportunities around net unrealized appreciation where they had some highly appreciated stock inside their retirement plan, and we were able to potentially, or are going to here likely at the end of the year, do a pretty big distribution from one of their 401(k) accounts and save them quite a bit in taxes because they do have some stock that is appreciated in value.

It’s not always just simply looking at saying, well, hey, what’s my expected future tax rate look like and how can I use that to best manage my tax bracket now? That is one major piece of it. But then there’s also all these other, again, like I mentioned before, maybe levers for lack of a better term, that well, hey, if we take your income up, you might be giving away a little bit of health subsidies from the government. Hey, you might be giving up this. We just need to be mindful of that.

And I think that goes back to, as I always am harping on here on the podcast, is good a financial advisor gets to know the individuals and the families that they’re working with and understanding some of those pros and cons and some of those levers helps build a better plan as we think about, well, what’s the next few years look like? What’s the next 10 years look like? And so on and so forth. But I think that tax bracket management is a big opportunity as we think about the close of 2024 and coming into 2025 with this looming increase in tax rates come 2026.

Walter Storholt:

The financial world is full of levers and unintended consequences, and you’re there to track it all for us, Tyler, appreciate that.

Tyler Emrick:

Getting back to that whole idea, I think one of the first comments I had here in the podcast were, “Hey, the tax code is extremely complex.” If I didn’t say that, I should have said it was in my notes. That was just another feather in the cap on that, I guess as we think about it.

There are two other changes, Walt, that I want to maybe dive into a little bit as well because I think, again, they impact the vast majority of individuals listening today, and that has to do with the standard deduction increase that we’re in right now and the SALT deduction actually being capped. The TCJ essentially said, hey, when we look at whether you’re going to take the standard deduction when you file your taxes or you’re going to itemize your deductions, well, for individuals that were itemizing their deductions before 2017, they got an itemized deduction, which we call the SALT deduction, which stands for State and Local Tax deduction. If you live in a state that has some pretty hefty state taxes, I’m thinking New York, California. Walt, I think you guys are in a flat tax there where you’re at from a state standpoint, but anybody listening that pays quite a bit in property taxes, state income taxes, so on and so forth, this SALT deduction was a very big, itemized deduction on your tax return. Well, what happened is they capped that at $10,000.

Essentially, you could take up to an itemized deduction of 10,000 for your SALT deduction and no more. That was a huge change for a lot of individuals that were itemizing on their tax return. The second change has to do with that standard deduction, essentially doubling from where it was before. The goal of that doubling was to really simplify the tax return for a lot of Americans. I think the statistics that I seen was upwards of 90% of Americans now actually just take the standard deduction because well, you almost have to have close to $30,000 of itemized deductions before you would actually itemize versus taking the standard if you’re married, filing jointly, cut that in half essentially, if you’re filing single. That’s quite a bit. And you pair that with this SALT deduction being capped at 10,000, a lot of individuals heading into 2018 found themselves in a scenario where they didn’t itemize anymore and they just took the standard.

Walter Storholt:

It was a huge change. I remember just so many people talking about that change and the impact that it had both on their returns. I’m raising my hand just from the standpoint of it helps a couple of these years with just how much tracking I was having to do to do the itemized deductions. It was nice to not have to stress over some of that anymore.

Tyler Emrick:

Yes. I think the comment that I heard is they were trying to make it to where the vast majority of Americans could file their taxes on the back of a postcard, was the comment that resonated [inaudible 00:23:57].

Walter Storholt:

It still doesn’t quite feel like that but it did at least move us in a little bit better direction there.

Tyler Emrick:

A little bit better direction. But you think about this idea of, well, hey, now I take the standard deduction, I used to itemize. That impacts individuals, I think, quite a bit. I had a meeting literally just last week with a family where I just met them, and part of the reason why they had actually reached out to me was unfortunately her sister had recently passed away and they inherited a pretty large sum of money. And prior to talking to me, one of the things that they did when they were inheriting that money as they actually made a pretty sizable gift to their church and another gift to a charity. That is not uncommon. You’re going through a tough time, you’re normally pretty charitably inclined, you get this large sum of money and individuals feel appropriate to gifts some of that.

We start thinking about any time you gift to a church or charity, that can potentially be an itemized deduction. In this family’s case, it was actually going to bump them over that standard deduction where they would actually start to itemize. So, you think about in a normal year for them when they file their tax return, they’re just taking the standard deduction. Again, almost $30,000 of a deduction. They were pretty charitably inclined but not quite to the degree that they’ve done this year. It wasn’t something that was top of their mind. But now what we’ve started to do here and we turned our attention toward the end of the year in saying, “Hey, you’ve already completed these gifts here this year. We know you’re going to be itemizing this year. By no means do you gift just to get a tax deduction, but if we can do it smartly and get a little bit of a tax break, why not?”

So, we started to have the conversation to say, “All right, in a normal year you are gifting, you’re not gifting enough to itemize your deductions, but can we maybe look at what you plan to gift come next year and maybe look at moving it into a donor-advised fund to where we can potentially get an additional itemized deduction for the gifting that you’re planning to do next year, and then that donor-advised fund, you could potentially then use it in 2025 to actually complete the gifting that you had planned. That way we take something to where come next year, they’re going to go back to taking the standard deduction. But they’re front-loading some of those additional gifts in this year since they’re already itemizing. We call that a bunching strategy where you’re trying to maximize those itemized deductions in a given year.

This is really this interplay between taking the standard deduction and itemizing has been something that we’ve been really working around since the tax law changes became in effect. If new legislation passes and that high standard deduction is maintained, I think it’s going to be a continued planning strategy in the coming years to try to say, hey, how do we use some of these gifting accounts or donor-advised funds to potentially bunch gifting in a particular year? That way you’re itemizing and getting a little bit of tax deduction for it, and then for a subsequent year, potentially taking the standard deduction and reaping some of those benefits over the long term. We’ll see what happens here with any new legislation, but I think that’s a good example of working around and the benefit of understanding, well, are you itemizing or are you taking the standard deduction? And if you have a unique year where something happens to you where your gifting might be higher or whatever the case is, how do you manage around it to make sure that you’re getting the biggest deduction that you can from a tax standpoint?

Walter Storholt:

Let me ask you this, Tyler, just a final question from my end of things is about timing. We’re here at the end of 2024, only a few months left. The election is what? Are we exactly a month away from our recording date here? Let me see.

Tyler Emrick:

About there. A little less than a month but yeah, a few days off.

Walter Storholt:

Less than a month now because we’re on the 5th. We’re taping today’s episode on the 8th of October, folks. We’re less than a month from the election. We’re closing in on the start of 2025, and although these tax cuts don’t sunset until the end of 2025, I guess people can proceed in 2025 with some pretty good confidence all of this is going to continue. I guess my question is when should we start to really expect to know what 2026 is going to look like and therefore, be able to start adjusting our behaviors a little bit? I imagine knowing that as far in advance as possible would be helpful. Do you have a sense of when this might all make more sense to us and allow us to start doing some actual planning?

Tyler Emrick:

December 30th of 2025. No [inaudible 00:29:05].

Walter Storholt:

You see this coming down to the wire.

Tyler Emrick:

Yeah, I do, but you never know. And certainly, if they can get something in earlier, that would be extremely helpful from a planning standpoint. I will say that our conversations even this year have had and been around this looming change coming the end of 2025. And really, I think it’s situational between each client as to… It brings up this good question of how aggressive do we get with our income tax planning. All signs point to, hey, this is a pretty low-income tax year. We got maybe another one in 2025. We have no idea what’s going to happen from a tax legislation standpoint and if they’re going to be able to maintain these low brackets. I think we said at the early beginning of the podcast, it would take about $4 trillion of found money here for us to maintain these tax cuts.

So, we’ll see what comes to fruition but I think this is where that you really lean on that relationship with your financial adviser and that back and forth and having a very honest conversation around what does each individual’s tax situation looks like over the next handful of years and beyond? How can we use that information and apply it to their specific situation to determine, what is the right sizing? Again, there are a ton of levers here, and each family has their own unique ones that we need to be mindful of. Some individuals might be in that camp of, yes, I want to continue to get pretty aggressive with our income tax planning and income targeting. What by aggressive is maybe you’re taking more distributions from your pre-tax retirement account, you’re doing bigger Roth conversions to try to pay those taxes now and get them out of the way and get them into more tax-efficient accounts.

And then on the other side, we probably have some individuals and families that are taking a little more conservative approach to it and being mindful. But in any case, I think come next year, this is going to be a pretty hot topic and communicated with us probably all throughout the year. So, as we approach the end of 2020, I think that’ll be a unique end of the year as we start to get some clarity on what we think the tax code’s going to get changed to and what year-end planning is going to need to be done. But yeah, it’s going to be a fun one come to the end of next year. To answer your question in maybe a more short and succinct way, yeah, I think it’ll come down to the wire at the end of next year on what’s going to happen.

Walter Storholt:

Last few days of the year. Congress and everybody will be trying to go home for the holidays. They’ll be trying to get it all figured out or maybe in between the holidays. We’ll have to see.

Tyler Emrick:

That’s right. Like I said, I don’t envy them by any means. It’s a hard question to answer, and by no means is everybody going to be happy with whatever happens, just depends on which constituents they want to benefit and continue to put in a reasonable situation.

Walter Storholt:

Yeah, it’s a great point. Here’s the last thought that I’ll leave folks with, and that is we were talking about the sunset of the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act about four years ago, and I remember thinking, that’s a really long time from now. Why are we even that worried about it? Boy, it has come up quick on us. End of next year, we’ll be here before you know it. So, don’t wait until then to get a relationship with an advisor, with somebody who can help you plan for those changes, even if they come through at that last minute. Go ahead and have that relationship and go through the planning and get a more solid financial plan in place now. You can do that with the team at True Wealth Design, of course. Tyler Emrick, Kevin Kroskey and all the great advisors there can help you out.

You can schedule an, are we right for you, consultation. A chance to schedule a fifteen-minute call with an experienced advisor on the team and see if you’re a good fit to work together. Go to truewealthdesign.com and you can schedule that time to visit from your smartphone or computer. Again, truewealthdesign.com. Just look for the opportunity to book a call there and you can get that set up and get on a better path to your financial future and retirement and all the joys and wonders in between with a more solid financial plan. Tyler, thanks for all the breakdown, and safe travels to you once again as you head to South Florida. We’ll catch up with you. Our next episode releases on Halloween. So, I don’t know, are you going to wear a costume next time we get together?

Tyler Emrick:

Maybe we’ll see. I’ll leave that up in the air.

Walter Storholt:

It’s audio so you can lie to us and say you’re wearing something if you want.

Tyler Emrick:

That’s true. I think I’ll probably end up being a Ninja Turtle this year, at least my oldest, she’s still pretty hot and heavy into Ninja Turtle. I don’t know. I got a princess and a turtle, so we’ll see which camp I end up playing in when it comes time.

Walter Storholt:

Hopefully, the turtle.

Tyler Emrick:

Yeah, we’ll leave princess to mom.

Walter Storholt:

There you go. Thank you, sir, and we look forward to chatting with you soon and thanks everybody for tuning in. We’ll see you next time on Retire Smarter.

Speaker 3:

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